Small Team or No Team? Learn to Create Team Efficiencies and CRM Automations with Clare Van Ness

Small Team or No Team? Learn to Create Team Efficiencies and CRM Automations with Clare Van Ness

For the first time ever, The Education Beyond Degrees Podcast goes LIVE at the UPCEA MEMS conference in Portland, Oregon!

🎙️ Building a modified strategic plan focused on fixing organization.

🎙️ How to create manual processes for everything you do in your unit.

🎙️ Using Salesforce (or any CRM) to build out workflows for automating hundreds of processes.

🎙️ Find checklists in the presentation for you to get to work right away!

The majority of our Continuing and Professional Education units have small or no marketing teams dedicated to doing the marketing and recruitment work necessary to grow your unit. What can you do if you are one of those units?

In episode 4 this season, Clare Van Ness, Dean of Professional and Continuing Education at California State University, Chico, and I go LIVE at the UPCEA MEMS conference! Clare is a long-time veteran of PCE who understood the need to create more efficiencies and automation in her unit and brought Spur in to do the necessary work.

In this LIVE session, we go over the project at Chico in detail and talk about how the 70+ in the audience can figure out how to build out their own workflows and add them to their Salesforce (or other CRM). Plus, we discuss how to start the research that will lead to understanding your organizational structure and the processes within.

You can follow along this episode with the actual slides of the presentation:


Links from the episode👇👇
California State University, Chico – Professional and Continuing Education
Meni’s LinkedIn
The Education Beyond Degrees Podcast Homepage

And finally, we are trying to grow our Continuing Education’s only global Slack group. Reach out to me directly and I will add you!



Meni: Hey, I’m Meni Sarris, and this is the Education Beyond Degrees podcast with The Spur Group, the podcast where a continuing education geek goes behind the scenes to talk shop about the people, trends, and ideas impacting our space

In today’s episode, we go live with the education beyond degrees podcast at the UPCEA MEMS 2023 conference in Portland, Oregon. My co presenter at this session is Clare Van Ness, the Dean of Professional and Continuing Education at California State University, Chico.

There’s a lot of things that I want to talk about in this presentation, but if you’ve never heard me speak before, the one thing that I like doing in presentations is making sure you walk away with some practical information that could get you started right away when you get back to campus. So I don’t like just sharing a story and talking through what happened. You actually walk away with items that you’ll be able to take so we’ll share the slides. In our agenda, we’ll do intros and then we’ll talk about the background, the plan and what the execution of the plan was.

Clare is at California State University, Chico, which is in the north part of the state of California. Her team is pretty small, but in terms of programming and revenue generation, it’s pretty big, especially for a rural area like Chico, California.

They do both credit and non credit, and the marketing team Is extremely small like this was it when it was started, right? So we had Clare, who’s the dean. She’s the leader of the organization. We had a marketing director and this is kind of a joke, but she’s the person who does everything in the department, like literally everything in the department.

Then we had a graphic designer. And then they outsourced a lot of their agency work that needed to be done. The technology they were using was PeopleSoft. They used Wufoo for their non credit registration. No CRM, nothing with automations, no other technology. This was it, right? So the problems that they had to figure out what to do was how do they build the right team in order to move forward what they were doing? How do they pick the right technology? And how do they deal with the obstacles that they face within the institution, right?

So, they don’t have the, they don’t have the FTE available to hire full time people. They don’t really have the money available to go out and hire big agencies because that comes at a really, really high cost. So how do they deal with the problem of having some money to spend but not having enough to get what they needed done, done?

And so this is the plan that we created together. Everything needed to be backed in research. Because the one thing that, as you all know, when you get asked to do something, you’re going to be asked, what data says that we need to do this? How do we know that what you’re doing is taking you on the right path to where you want to go for the investment you want to make?

So, we had to start everything with research. From there, we did a strategic plan, modified, we’ll talk about it. Then we looked at the organization, looked at the process and workflows, which we’ll talk about a lot here. The technology, and then what the future of the actual organization is going to look like.

So, step by step, this is where you’re going to have a lot of takeaways. And we’re going to talk through it. If you have questions on each slide, we can take questions as we go. There’s going to be about eight more slides after this, so we’ll have a little bit of time to talk through things. So, everything starts in research.

Clare’s organization, because they were so small and they hadn’t done a lot on the research side to back a lot of the decision making that we did.

And that we found this out pretty early that they were doing things mostly from the instruction coming from the university, but also on some of the ideas that they were doing. But we needed to create more research to back the ideas in order to justify what the work that we wanted to do and what was best for Chico at the time.

And so when we look at how to do the research, we really ask these questions of how we’re doing our research. First, you go into every research project with your list of questions of what you’re researching and why. You have to have a goal, you have to have an understanding, and you have to be able to ask all the people the same questions.

This gives you a very, very simple way of staying within the method and getting very detailed answers to these questions. It’s like having a business requirement document. You have all these questions that you want to get these answers to, and this research and this data, you’ll be able to tag it to get the information that justifies the cause of what you want to do later.

So it’s really important that Once you build out these questions, you identify who’s going to be involved in it, you do your tagging process, and then you go out and you talk to your competitors, your colleagues, your peers to figure out what else they’re doing in order to gather this data. You always start from the foundational level of what your organization is doing and then move from there. That could be the entire department. That could just be the marketing side of the house. That could be the programming side of the house. Each part of the organization should be doing these things to have the information.

 So when we got the research, it led us to figuring out what the strategic plan was. Now, when we use the term strategic plan. Most people think, oh, five, ten years, plan, where we want to be. This is more of a modified, we know what we wanted to get out of this, so what plan are we going to put together to add dates to it, to add the people who are going to own what that plan and those goals are, to make sure we hold them accountable based on the research that we did, that they are part of building the plan.

So for those of you who run an organization, The biggest thing that you can do to build buy in on what the future is, is have everybody come on at the onset of this planning process. It doesn’t matter who they are. The more everybody knows within your organization, your unit, your department, the stronger the plan is going to be, because they’ll all be agreeing to what all the points are, what the plan is, what the goals are, the timelines and everything, and everybody has buy in.

This is one thing at Chico that we found really interesting, is not everybody within that unit Had been part of these discussions at all times. Because the marketing director was kind of everywhere and doing everything and Clare was doing what deans do, which isn’t being in the minutiae of things, it was very difficult for everybody to know what was going on at all times. So. When we brought the whole group together to start building out this modified strategic plan, it changed everything. It changed the view of how they were discussing things. It changed the understanding of what they were doing and the why.

And they all knew that they were becoming a part of what the future was going to hold. So, when you do a plan like this and you look through the research, and you have all those questions that you’re looking to get answered, once you start adding the stakeholders and who could take ownership of each one, and they’ve agreed on when they want to accomplish everything,

The way the department works changes.

Everything about it works differently because now they’ve agreed to where they want to go. They see the vision, they understand where they want to take it, and they understand why. Right? It’s not just telling them, you have to do this because of this. It’s, hey, if we do this We could have this success in the future.

No matter what the size of the organization is, we know that that creates the biggest buy in when they understand the why and what matters for them in the future and what value they’re, they’re adding personally to what the organization is doing. So this is a really, really good mapping out of what you’re going to be doing. For the organization as you move forward.

You should be going back to your strategic plans and what the plans you’ve put forward to make sure it’s still accurate every six months because so much changes so quickly that you have to revisit it to make sure everybody is doing the in the same path in the same motion that you started off with because it’s critically important, especially how everything changes.

So when we did the organization, this is where the biggest change begins to happen. When we looked at Clare’s team, we had Flatline organization going across the board where everybody was kind of just doing what they’ve done for a very, very long time. There’s no. I have a preferred way of building out CE departments, personally.

When I was a dean, I had a certain way of doing it, and there’s been successes. But every unit and every organization is very, very different. Your constituents, your students, everybody that you deal with has to have a different way of dealing with your team. So, when we looked at Clare’s team, there was a very, very clear delineation between who should be doing programming, who should be doing marketing, who should be doing business and operations.

So when we built out these three areas, Clare then got a cabinet with all of these individual leaders. Who then work together to figure out how the three areas will communicate with each other. This was probably the biggest change that Chico had to go through. Before, the marketing director, because she was everywhere, she was kind of the voice of each of these areas.

But, when Clare now had her cabinet, her three leaders that she could lean on to figure out what was going at all times, now all of a sudden you had somebody in charge of programming, somebody in charge of marketing, and somebody in charge of business and operations, and those directors at the top would be the ones working together to make sure the communication between those three areas was running smoothly, and they were each holding each other accountable for the responsibilities that each one of them had.

 We went through every single person, interviewed them, we went through every single job description. We worked with HR, we worked with Clare to figure out where all of these people are and what they’re doing. And we do this exercise, it’s called the love hate exercise. It’s a quadrant that we use, and it says love, hate, good at, bad at.

 And so the goal is to have 100 percent of your department doing what they love and what they’re good at. The other goal is you want to have 100 percent of your department never in that I’m bad at it box, right? But sometimes they could be good at something and hate it and you might need them to do it.

So the one part of every job description that you all either hate or you love is this section called other duties as a sign, right? All of us have it, no matter what the job is, and for an administrator, it is the greatest, most flexible tool of anything that we have. Whether you’re unionized or not unionized, we could utilize this to really change how people work and the direction of what their job is.

So, if you’ve ever tried changing a job description, you know how tedious that is, and it’s a mess. So, we have to really lean on how to utilize the other duties as assigned. To make sure that everybody within the organization is doing the work that needs to be done in a way that they’re enjoying their work.

So we spent time interviewing every single person. We did the quadrants, we figured out what they loved, what they hated, what they were good at, what they were bad at. And ultimately, with Chico, I think we only had one person that, as we adjusted what the jobs they were doing within their job description and their unit, I think we only had one person doing things that they didn’t like but they were good at.

So it was one of those that actually worked out pretty well because you never know when you get hired for a job and you’re there for 10 15 years, right, you get hired and things change so much, your job description, changed so much, you’ve evolved so much, because HR doesn’t tell you to change job descriptions, you’re just getting things added on, things are changing, things are moving, so again, these are things to revisit So To make sure that your team is staying up to what needs to be done and you’re utilizing this other duties as a sign to get to a path or to a place where you could actually change that job description where everybody’s meeting the list of what needs to happen and they’re doing it with enjoyment.

I can’t emphasize enough how important to talk to your staff and figure out what they love to do because you have no idea some of the things that they could be really good at that. That’s just not part of the job description, but could fit into what your unit needs. So many times, even in Clare’s team, we moved people around that we had no idea wanted to move around, but because they were stuck in where they were in their job descriptions and they were happy they’d been there for a while, you know, they’ve done professional development outside doing other things.

It’s like, well, if you love doing it and you’re good at it, why not utilize it for some of the work that we need? And it just adds that environment of Working together and giving people what they want and, you know, happy staff members, make a happy work environment. So, you know, I always run by the motto, like, I love when people leave and get better jobs, but if I could professionally develop you and keep you and keep you happy, it’s a way better thing than trying to hire new people.

 If you give people what they love to do and what they’re good at, they’ll stay longer because they’ll see that you’re invested in them, that you actually care about what they’re doing.

With Clare’s team, once we did this organizational switch as we were doing this organizational switch, we started going to the documentation process of figuring out what they do, adding an actual process and workflow to every single thing that happens within a department.

This is where things start going really, really crazy. So on a daily basis, you go into your job, you go into your office and you’re doing something right. Right. No matter what it is, there’s an actual process to what you’re doing. Right? How many of you have a CRM? Who has Salesforce? Yes. Who doesn’t have Salesforce? I’m sorry. What do you guys who don’t have Salesforce have? Slate? HubSpot? Is anybody like on a Zoho or Are you? Alright, so. In your CRM, how many of you have already put in not just marketing automation tools, but in, inside organization tools that follow workflows. Good.

Okay, just one. Not good. We’ll talk about this more. So, everything that you do, every project that you have, every piece of research, every part of what you do in marketing recruitment, doesn’t matter what it is. Program development, it doesn’t matter what it is. There is a process to everything.

Everything that you do has an owner, it has somebody who has to successfully complete it, and it has to have someone attached to it with a time frame, right? All of this are processes. Hundreds of them. Your organization probably may have thousands of them. It is so critically important. And it’s not just for onboarding, training, and hiring.

But once you have your processes in place to understand how you function within the unit, things start running at a different level. All of a sudden your one and a half person marketing team now feels like it’s a five, ten person because of the amount of work that could get done on fully processed and fully understood processes within the organization.

So, we started working with Clare and her team and we started processing out everything. We started figuring out how programming does it, what marketing is doing, what operations is doing, what budgeting is doing, how the leaders work, how they’re communicating with students, how they’re communicating with administration, how they’re communicating with other departments on campus.

All of this became part of the process procedure. From there, what we can put within the CRM and within the system became internal workflows. All of these workflows created a path to get from the idea to the completion of that idea.

And once you get people in, within owning those workflows, These automations change how you do things. Once you put workflows into Salesforce or whatever CRM you have, and you have these automations happening, whether it’s communications with students, with, with faculty, or whoever else might be, now all of a sudden the way that you work and how fast you get through the work that needs to get done is just astounding.

Like it just changes everything and it all starts here. When you go back to your unit, this is a very tedious, laborious job, but everything that you do has a process. I always tell people, keep a post-it pad on your desk, and every time you start doing something, just start drawing out a workflow. A workflow and a process workflow is super simple.

I provided this legend. You’ll be able to see it on, on the, on the on the slides when we, when we upload ’em. But this is super simple. You want to be able to create a process. There’s always a start. There’s always something that describes what the action and process is.

There’s often a decision, a yes no decision. All of this that creates where you start to where you want to end. Right? If there’s documents attached to it, it’s super critical that you know what those documents are and how you get in there. Once you start building out these processes, and once you have this large process manual for your organization, you have this workbook of, like, hundreds things that you’re doing and now when somebody has a question or when somebody needs to understand how to do things, they could look at this and understand how the process flows, how it works internally and how you could get from the small team you’re at today to a much bigger level organization because these work this way.

 When we talk about a small organization, this is where the most critical piece has come in. When you start building automations, you have to talk a lot about it. If I had this person that I can’t afford, what would they be doing, right? If I had this person that I need, but we don’t have the FTE for it, what would they be doing?

What the process and the workflow allows you to do is understand what that organizational piece is, create it into an automation, and then hopefully, the idea would be to train somebody to do that very specific job if there is a piece that needs to be done throughout that workflow. Oftentimes, we could automate it so we have that functionality done as part of what a CRM or what our unit does. But if there is somebody attached to it now, it allows for that workflow to move through that person and actually have that touch point.

This is one of the scenarios that we were using. It’s a student that wants to register for a program with, with prerequisites, right? And there’s an approval process. So this is a very, very simple one that Chico is dealing with all the time. You guys probably deal with this all the time. And so the idea was, what happens when a student wants to register online? If there are prerequisite materials that have to be uploaded and approved, this is one of those examples that it goes, the documents get put in, And the workflow takes us through the application and doc that gets sent to whoever the program leader was. So right here is where we have the person who’s accountable for this one.

So in this scenario, the person who owns the course or the person who owns the program is the person who has to approve it. So in this workflow, the moment a student is online and registers and takes that document, the workflow automatically takes that, sends it to the person who’s the owner, and the decision making has to happen as soon as the owner provides it.

Typically, you could attach a time set to it. So if you want to say, if you want to tell your students, we’ll get back to you in 24 hours, you could set that. That person has known that they have 24 hours to respond to the student. It gets pinged to them, it’ll get delivered to the email or wherever you want to send it as part of the workflow.

And then from there they go into the decision making process, right? Decision making is almost always going to be yes, no. If you go into the yes, Very easy, the workflow automatically takes you to where the student gets enrolled. This could be a manual or an automatic registration, it depends on how you want to do it but again, it’s how you build out the workflow.

Now, if the decision is no, this is the other part that’s really important when you build out these workflows. You have to figure out what all the no possibilities in the scenario are going to be. Is the application not completed? Are the prerequisites not what they need to be?

So you have to go through. and figure out direct communication with the student. So this goes back to this person now, right? Or maybe it’s they have an assistant, whatever it is. That person has to communicate with the student to understand what’s missing, then take them back through into will the student reapply or are they just not qualified for it?

And then if they do reapply, they restart the workflow. And so if the end decision is to get the students enrolled in the program, that’s great. If not, sometimes they just get added to your CRM, they could be a future recruitment person or whatever it is. But this is a very, very simple workflow of a very major process within your organization.

 If you were to go into Salesforce or your CRM, This is a, an abandoned cart workflow, like this is just one of the examples that we like to show. When you go into your CRM, it’s really this quick to build a workflow, right?

You’re in there, in an abandoned cart, it’s very simple. Somebody puts a program in a cart, they decide, Hey, I don’t really want this course anymore, but we’ve already set it up where you’ve caught their information. And so in this workflow, we’re grabbing the information, the student leaves. Whoever, whatever information came on to that abandoned cart, so it’s going to be first name, last name, email.

Now this goes into your workflow, automated email gets sent, like, hey, we saw you here, you know, do you want to come back? It becomes another tool that you don’t lose the student who’s come in, and there’s ownership to this, right? So, in your CRM, as you build it out, so this is Salesforce, obviously. So, once you build this out, you have an owner who has taken ownership of the email.

And then if the student doesn’t respond, the workflow continues, right? Oftentimes, in an abandoned cart, you do two to three communication follow ups and understand how the workflow works. But the big, important part is, the manual workflow and the process that you’re doing can be easily put into your CRM, whether you’re doing these outbound marketing techniques or recruitments, having to actually have conversations with students, or for accountability purposes internally, whoever is in your CRM and working, who has to take ownership of these. And as a leader, you could actually, you track all of these things in the CRM, too.

The one reason we say that you always go back to these is because there’s always going to be something that creates a new decision that has to be made. But the more you keep adding to it, the more it just makes your makes your organization work better together. It is complicated. And it is, it’s a lot of work, but once you have it, like this process can be huge. There’s some processes that we did that are just like, they could be pages.

Because there’s a lot of this coming back. When it comes to decisions and the students have to do something or something has to be done, we often have to come back. But once the workflow is built, all you’re doing is editing it. You’ll figure out where those weak spots are, and then you’ll be able to come back and take the corrective action on them as you need.

 This is the biggest part of this presentation. Who has a salesforce admin on their team who has salesforce. Okay, you guys are incredibly lucky, right? So like your salesforce admin should be able to do these things really, really quickly. All of these processes, the more you could put into your salesforce instance, the better it’s or any CRM. It’s going to be better for you how you organizationally work. It’s super, super critical because this is where small teams could become super, super functional.

 To have a Salesforce certified person on staff if you have Salesforce is, is a pretty big deal. Cause they’re expensive. And they’re very hard to find.

At this point, we had a question come in about the organization and how it works with these processes.

Great question. So now this goes back to what Clare does as a dean, right? So, the one thing Clare and her cabinet, once they build out these processes and their workflows, now we know how the organization runs. So, as a dean, your job is very, very different than the people that are doing the, the day to day. You have other responsibilities, you have to be the face of the unit out in the community and all that. But this gives Clare a very, very clear way. Of understanding how the organization works and her cabinet now has a very streamlined approach to how their team is working and how everything is working within those three areas in the organization.

So her programming person, her marketing person and her business and operation person all have their own set of workflows, but are also working together. Programming and marketing have to work together. Now all of a sudden, those conversations have become so much easier because programming knows what they’re doing and now there’s a handoff.

Clare, you can talk about the handoff and how that’s changed so much. But programming to marketing we know is one of the most difficult handoffs that we can do. But now there’s a workflow set to when they’re doing their research, when they move from the programming and they’re ready to get the marketing done, it changes everything.

Because there’s an exact time when it happens. So now the organization is working on these time frames that allow for you to know. Based on what was agreed upon at that process build, in that workflow build, who enters, what happens, what that handoff looks like, and who takes ownership from those steps from then on.

We were joking, if you were in the room earlier, about programming versus marketing. Like, this has been, you know, when I was a dean, I had to, like, referee these fights all the time. You know, people who build programs think they can market their programs, and marketing’s just like, shut up. Just stop. Like, go back in your lane.

But now we’ve built this. Way where there’s a synergy between these and now we know who’s good at what and where these handoffs happen.

We had another question come in, asking us, how long does this take?

 What the processes are going to be and all that. They were very unique because their organization had been this flat level org chart for a long time and Clare knew what the vision, what her vision was and where she wanted to get to.

And we were also working with some people that we knew weren’t good fits based on their expertise and all those things. So that part probably usually takes about two months. The process part does take a while. I would say it took us probably about four, four months to do the process, building out the processes. But this was also working simultaneously in training everybody. One of the things that we always do is that we’re educators at heart. So every single step of this process, we were training the team in why we were doing it and what was needed.

 There would be homework assignments, they would be completing homework assignments or processes. We’d be reviewing processes, they’d be reviewing processes internally. And depending on the size of your organization, Chico isn’t that big. But like you’re from University of Washington, are you part of Continuum?

So like Continuum is huge, right? That you have a lot of different areas of it, so there’s a lot more people at play, so, you know, Clare started with, what was it, like 16 people, 15, something like that, so it started from there, if your organization has like 50, 60, 80, 100, you know, some people have hundreds of people in their organization, this could become really, really long.

But, just like any other major important document that you build, like a business requirement document, it will change the future of how your organization works. So, putting the work in to get it done will ultimately change everything that you do in the future. So, it could take a while, but, again, it’s one of those things, like, once you do it, like University of Central Florida, they built a business requirement document for their Salesforce org, right?

It took them 16 months. But, what they’ve done is created the most amazing business requirement document I’ve ever seen in my entire life. I actually use it in this example because they’ve understood how they want their organization to work, how they want it to look, and who’s involved in every process.

And now, moving forward, they spent that 16 months, it’s going to change how they work and how flawlessly and easily they work together.

We had another question slash statement, come in that talked about this living, breathing document within the organization.

You know, a document or process flows or whatever it is. That ownership of that they have for the process and the workflow and do it themselves updated themselves. So this live and breathing document has ownership. It has feelings attached to it. It has buy in. It has people who actually want to be part of an organization that’s growing because they understand what part they play.

I think that’s one thing that we’ve always done pretty bad in organizations is not letting like even like your front desk workers, the customer service people who work 15 hours a week answering phones like they have workflows that they take ownership and they could see. The result of their work actually ends in something great and often times they don’t get a chance to see that.

Yeah, great question. So the question, if you didn’t hear it was, how easy is it to edit these workflows? Super easy, right? So if you have the manual workflow or your workflows in salesforce, it’s literally what you’ll most likely do when you make a change to a workflow. It’ll almost always be a decision that has to be put in there that you didn’t think about before.

So you add a decision, a yes, no, and then create that path back or forward to where you needed to go. So Once you start doing this, you’ll recognize how quickly those changes come, you know, I would say when we make an edit to, like, that abandoned card, if I wanted to add one more, it would be an idea that I had, I’d go back in, 30 seconds later, the workflow would be updated.

Alright, so technology wise with Chico. So the next steps for Chico are to take everything that they’ve done and they’re going through a university wide implementation of Salesforce. So If you’ve done this on your campus, it’s tedious, it’s long Chico and Clare, Clare will talk about the obstacles in a second but they’re going to be using Salesforce within their PCE unit as really the, the, the foundational piece of technology that they have. They’ll be going out to Salesforce and they’re facing a lot of obstacles.

And I would say probably a lot of the challenges that you might face are also, if you’re like in a continuing ed or continuing professional education unit, you’re also oftentimes looked at as. Maybe lower on the totem pole of importance within the institution where your voice doesn’t matter, but Clare is doing the right thing and making sure her voice is heard.

So it’s one of those things that the earlier you get in that conversation, the better it’s going to be, especially on a CRM instance, you should be able just to have your own instance. It doesn’t have to do with the whole entire universities instance, but I T likes to be very protective.

 So as they’re as they’re moving into the future of this project, like we already talked about the salesforce implementation, they’re continuing their workflow development right as as they get into their salesforce systems. That’s where they’re going to start taking their manual processes and putting them into workflows, which will ultimately end in about a 50 percent automation of what they’re Processes are. Right now, Clare’s team. They’re not. They’re not in the current phase of hiring another person in marketing that what they want to do is they want to continue to outsource some of the cheaper things rather than adding an FTE to it. But the plan down the road as they continue to grow is to add some more FTE on the marketing side because of how critical it is and then from there, really understanding how to continue the training, how to talk about the processes, how to do how to focus their tech stack on Salesforce and doing the things that they’re doing on Salesforce.

And then again, this is probably the biggest thing that has, that goes back to the title of this presentation is you only hire when you have full time work to hire. In marketing, this is tricky because you have, you know, just like any marketing agency, there are very, very specific things that designers do content, all of this, but it’s hard to hire if unless you have that need as an FTE need.

Sometimes you only need that one thing or, or you find somebody who could do it on a recurring basis. So it’s one of those things that, you know, as long as you have something that you could outsource quickly, it’s probably better than bringing in FTE, honestly, until you have that, that big need.

You have seven minutes. Perfect! Seven minutes for questions. I know that was a lot. We’ll upload the slides so you can have all those checklists. But this really goes back to the idea is how to build out that process document that living, breathing document to then get into your Salesforce or into your CRM to create that space that allows you to do so much more so much quicker.

Thank you for listening to this episode of the Education Beyond Degrees podcast with The Spur Group. If you liked what you heard, you can find this episode along with a ton of other resources on the website. See you on the next episode.